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作者: funbk (快樂自己找) 看板: CrossStrait
標題: Re: [討論] 專業醫生對陳水扁中槍案的觀感與看法
時間: Fri Mar 26 18:33:26 2004
※ 引述《HwaJet (Authority)》之銘言：
: 專業醫生對陳水扁中槍案的觀感與看法
: 我的朋友是美籍華僑
: 同時之前也是執業10年的急診室醫生
: 他根據他的經驗對陳水扁中槍案寫了一篇他的觀感與看法
: 希望大家用理性的眼光去看這篇文章
: 原文如下
: From me, Emergency Medicine Doctor with 10 years of experience:
: 我本人是一位具有10年以上經驗的急診醫療醫師
: All GSW's are high energy wounds. It means that GSW will cause extensive bruising along the edges of the wound almost immediately. In the picture, where is the bruising on both of them?
: 所有的槍擊傷口都是屬於高度灼傷的傷口.這表示傷口會在瞬間將傷口的邊緣燒焦.從這幾張照片看起來，握看不到這現象..
: GSW's are almost never symmetrical nor linear. They are round and small, Even if they are shot directly from the side, it’s impossible to create a linear wound because the bullet often tumbles while traveling towards the target. The exit wound is usual: ly bigger than the entrance. Why does his wound look like someone just took a knife a#e
: cut. You can not!!
: 槍傷的傷口通常是不對稱而且非直線.通常是圓而小.做算是差身而過.因為子彈在飛行過程是翻滾的所以不可能會造成直線形傷口.子彈穿出的地方的傷口會比進去的地方來的大.為何阿扁的傷口看起來就像是被刀子割到的？難道他們日本的切腹片子看多了嗎？想像妳用一根牙籤以高速度去戳: 一個橘子.你可以將那橘子造成對稱而且線形的切痕？跟你說，不可能！
: How can Lu still be standing after been shot in the knee? The knees are major weight wearing joint in our body. NO ONE I have ever seen got shot in the knee could still be standing!!
: 呂秀蓮居然能夠膝蓋中彈而站立如常！要知道膝蓋是全身重量最主要的支撐點，我生平沒有看到過一個人膝蓋中彈還能站立的...
因為只是擦過而已
子彈並沒有進去
且一開始受傷時 他們心理上都認為只是被鞭炮炸到
所以較不會緊張
: All GSW's by bullets are small. Unless they are shot gun wounds. No one would ever use a shot gun for assassination because the range is short and its blasts would spray too wide to be effective. The ideal weapon of choice is rifle. Rifle bullet creat: es a small hole but the damage is done INTERNALLY because of its high ve6m
: BRUISING?
: 所有槍傷的傷口都是小的.除非是散彈槍.但是沒有人會在近距離使用散彈鎗.因為距離太短而且波及範圍太大會造成效果減弱..因此最理想的鎗是來福槍.來福槍是最佳的致命武器，因為它能夠造成傷口小但是對於傷口內的傷害最大.也因為它的高能.所以一定會造成很明顯的瘀青..整個傷口뜺 |呈現傷口小.內部大傷而且廣泛.但是我沒有看到這樣的傷口..
: Where is the swelling? Being shot is like getting hit by a hammer, but at twice the speed of sound. Have you ever hit yourself on the finger with a hammer? Or walked into a coffee table? Don't u get a big bruise and it swells? Where is the swelling that: I see all the time when I am in the ER treating GSW patients?
: 也沒有看到腫脹.因為槍傷的傷口會像被一個2倍音速的榔頭敲打過一樣..你有沒有被鐵槌不小心敲過？或者腳指頭被桌腳壓過？那傷口不就是瘀青而且腫脹嗎？我看過許多的槍傷患者，但是就只有阿扁的傷口沒有上述情形，真是天佑台灣。
: Why is he standing up in the picture and still dressed? Am I too cautious in the ER when I am working or the doctor who was treating him is a moron! If you were shot, would you still have enough nerves left to be standing? Even if you could be so calm and: stand, any competent doctor would insist that you lay down since all GSW's are potentially assumed Le
: 照片中的阿扁是站立照相而且還穿著衣服？他們當所有急診室的醫生都是白痴嗎？我不相信有人被子彈打到還能冷靜到站著照相！就算是你能，一位有經驗的醫生也會馬上要你躺下，因為槍傷往往有潛在的致命危機.而且一位醫師絕不會讓有需要開刀的患者還穿著衣服的...
: Why is the wound on side? Any shooter would shoot from the front or the back because you have more chance of killing your target. Why would the shooter wait to shoot him from the side, in a moving vehicle, standing in a huge crowd? Is he another moron li: ke the treating doctor or maybe there was NEVER a shooter!!!
: 傷口為何是從側面而過？開槍者難道不知道從正面或後面開槍的勝算最大嗎？而且是在人群中並且瞄準移動的標靶的側面.難道他跟奇美的醫生一樣白痴嗎？
: How did the shooter not hit anyone else? He must be an Olympic shooting champion! Or he does not exist!
: Why not shoot the head? If the shooter was so good to hit him from the side. Why not shoot the head? I can see that the shooter thinking that target might be wearing a bullet-proof vest and hit him low. But why hit him low when he is standing in a car w: hich makes it very difficult to aim because of too many obstructions. Then take the HEAD shot!!
: 而且居然沒有射到其他的人，這位仁兄一定是奧運選手或者根本就沒有這個人..如果槍手的技術好到能從側面射傷.那他幹麻不直接射頭部？我能夠意會槍手一定是設想阿扁有穿防彈衣所以就射的低一點，但是為何他要選擇障礙多而且不易瞄準的下部而不直射頭部？
: Why is the shooter shooting at her knees? Is he blind? OR THERE IS NO SHOOTER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
: 槍手居然明顯的部位不射，卻專挑難瞄準的膝蓋！他瞎了狗眼嗎？還是根本子虛烏有？
槍手不是專業的
所以瞄不準
混在人群中不敢把槍擺的太明顯
趁著鞭炮聲大響時開槍
他只想給扁呂教訓
或許只是個激進份子 看他們不順眼
我覺得也有這個可能
如果不把槍手當成專業的來看
就比較合理
: How can they not know they were shot? They both said they didn’t know they were shot….. Well…. All my patients, in the ER, when they were attacked, all of them knew at the very moment they were shot by a bullet without needing any previous experience o: f GSW. Being shot is like getting hit by a professional boxer. The speed generated by a bullet traveling at least twice the speed of sound can knock any one back a step. Think of JFK’s assassination. In the film, when he got shot in the head,
: remember how violently his head wobbled! Didn’t it look like he was being punched by a boxer except you can not see the boxer? How can both of them just say “oh… I felt something burning… and saw blood…. What a stupid lie… Who was their acting coach: ??
: 阿扁說他不知到中槍！所有我的患者在中彈的當場就知道他中彈了而且也不用以前有過中彈的經驗，因為被槍射擊就好像是被一位職業拳擊手打到一樣..被一個2倍音速的物體擊到.任何人都會倒退！你可以回想拳擊賽的畫面.那些投被打到的拳擊手的頭部震動的慢動作..但是你只聽到阿扁說: ；好像有東西在燒.然後看到血..真他媽的鬼扯，叫他們的導演好好進修一番....
: Why didn't they go to a closer hospital but drove further to another hospital? Were the body guards so dumb they didn’t know where is the closest hospital? Or…. THEY HAVE TO GO TO A HOSPITAL THEY HAVE ALREADY PREVIOUSLY SET UP!!!!!!!
: 為何不到就近的醫院！難道哪那些隨扈不知到就近的醫院嗎？或者他們要到已經預先準備的醫院？
當天駕駛是本地人
事情發生後隨扈詢問他到哪個醫院較好
他說奇美
因為路較順 而他們也4分鐘就到了
(據某電視台訪問那個駕駛而知的)
: I can not believe they put up such fake stuff on TV without talking at least to an ER/trauma doctor with GSW experience so at least the wounds look believable.
: 我真不敢相信這些醫生外行到要假裝一個傷口也假裝不好..
: They are so unbelievably stupid and what an embarrassment for Taiwan for those two clowns to make up such bull shit for the whole world to see........... So sad!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
: 我真不敢相信所有台灣人民被這二位小丑搞到讓全世界看笑話是有多丟臉、多荒謬！
: Jay
我是用另一個角度來看待這件事的
我真的認為如果扁呂要藉假造傷口來博得選民同情
那他們大可不必假造這麼一個引人非議的傷口
且再中彈時他們也大可演的像一點
表情再明顯痛苦一點
動作再大一點
讓街上民眾及全國人民 清楚的知道他們遭受槍擊
且傷口很大又很痛
這樣會成功許多
但他們並沒有
當天街上的民眾 有很多都沒有察覺到異狀
大部分人在車群加速開走時
還認為是因為行程耽誤到 必須離開
我想
如果他們真的要假造槍擊案賺取選票
那麼事情發展就不會是今天這樣了吧
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作者: uync (除了報告還有什麼) 看板: CrossStrait
標題: 明天是怎樣..??台北要暴動了嗎..??
時間: Fri Mar 26 20:21:18 2004
有點莫名其妙的感覺 明天到底想幹麻
今天鬧的還算小咖喔
踢壞中選會的公佈欄不算違法嗎
馬市長總算下令抓人 到底說真的說假的
警察無辜被打
明明國親叫民眾過去的 卻又說不負責任
很不懂...暴民的定義是什麼
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→ aceo:假的啦...他只會震怒跟慢跑而已...... 推 140.112.243.67 03/26
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作者: Menss (球迷觀點) 看板: CrossStrait
標題: 最後努力之...驗票法律爭議
時間: Sat Mar 27 00:54:45 2004
※ [本文轉錄自 politics 看板]
作者: Menss (球迷觀點) 看板: politics
標題: 最後努力之...驗票法律爭議
時間: Sat Mar 27 00:48:55 2004
今天在立院修法部份，國親又再度犯了基本法理的錯誤，竟然在法條中要求列
入組成公正調查委員會，來調查槍擊事件。其詳細條文的文字我沒記住，但其
意就是要想要在法中明確規定組成調查委員會。
這真的不可，立法權怎能又干擾檢調單位的司法權，國親想要把槍擊的調查和
驗票在立法上綁在一起，那是要不得的想法，完全罔顧了法治的基本法理。
而且立法委員又有多少有檢調的專業能力與公正性，如果讓外行的立委干預司
法檢調權，那真的又鬧了大笑話。
但我個人也希望內政部提高總統槍擊案偵辦的層級規格，加速破案找到真相，
也請盡快與國親協商出公正專業的聯合調查小組，共同協助偵辦。
此外，國親一直援用民事訴訟法，說只要兩造同意，就可在法院的見證下，
立即全面驗票，那是在無相關規定時，才可援用，但選罷法裡都有明確的
相關規定，所以依法理，是無法援用的，請大家千萬要弄清楚。
請把正確的資訊盡可能傳達給還沒失去理性的朋友
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※ 發信站: 批踢踢實業坊(ptt.cc)
◆ From: 61.66.93.167