→ esnique:真想罵人.................太過分了吧 推 61.230.115.29 02/13
→ maria08452:只憑傳聞就討厭阿根廷全隊,不可取啊= = 推 61.230.102.81 02/13
→ maria08452:借轉南美板 推 61.230.102.81 02/13
→ Seles:(略過XD) 推 61.64.84.86 02/13
→ ouch:這報導是經過證實的嗎?還是只是小道消息? 推 203.203.34.127 02/13
→ Seles:是經過證實的話,ATP早就不用玩了...=.= 推 61.64.84.86 02/13
→ Seles:DC也不用打了…連小道消息也不算吧…只能 推 61.64.84.86 02/13
→ Seles:說是一種極端的偏見跟印象作崇吧…? 推 61.64.84.86 02/13
→ Seles:(Rusedski那種的才算尚待證實中) 推 61.64.84.86 02/13
→ ouch:我問的是"Voltchkov說的話是經過證實的嗎" 推 203.203.34.127 02/13
→ ouch:反應會不會過頭了點?我說的是"這報導"! 推 203.203.34.127 02/13
→ Seles:喔,六會了XD sorry ^^a 這要問Nico~~ 推 61.64.84.86 02/13
→ ouch:我當然知道後面的話一定是用來挑撥的... 推 203.203.34.127 02/13
→ ouch:也有可能是網友故意上來假造的,不是嗎? 推 203.203.34.127 02/13
→ Seles:別生氣啊`~~我的回答不是針對你啦:)別六會 推 61.64.84.86 02/13
→ ouch:如果沒有經過客觀的新聞稿,誰都可以放話啊 推 203.203.34.127 02/13
→ ouch:我想說的是:那一頁留言版就能代表事實嗎? 推 203.203.34.127 02/13
→ esnique:關於這是不是真的,後面有相關討論啊,可以 推 61.230.115.29 02/13
→ esnique:自己去看看,自己判斷囉。 推 61.230.115.29 02/13
→ ouch:我是比較傾向由較正式的管道去驗證... 推 203.203.34.127 02/13
→ ouch:因為人言可畏,加油添醋的人永遠不會少掉 推 203.203.34.127 02/13
→ MARSAFIN:借轉ALL-RUSSIANS版。 謠言止於智者:) 推218.175.239.144 02/13
→ zerkchu:menstennisforums.com一向都愛加油添醋:p 推 203.219.101.22 02/14
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------- <
作者: Escude (silence is gold rose XD) 看板: Tennis
標題: Re: [DC]Voltchkov認為阿根廷隊員都用禁藥。
時間: Sat Feb 14 09:03:32 2004
→ maria08452:只憑傳聞就討厭阿根廷全隊,不可取啊= = 推 61.230.102.81 02/13
→ maria08452:借轉南美板 推 61.230.102.81 02/13
→ Seles:(略過XD) 推 61.64.84.86 02/13
→ ouch:這報導是經過證實的嗎?還是只是小道消息? 推 203.203.34.127 02/13
→ Seles:是經過證實的話,ATP早就不用玩了...=.= 推 61.64.84.86 02/13
→ Seles:DC也不用打了…連小道消息也不算吧…只能 推 61.64.84.86 02/13
→ Seles:說是一種極端的偏見跟印象作崇吧…? 推 61.64.84.86 02/13
→ Seles:(Rusedski那種的才算尚待證實中) 推 61.64.84.86 02/13
→ ouch:我問的是"Voltchkov說的話是經過證實的嗎" 推 203.203.34.127 02/13
→ ouch:反應會不會過頭了點?我說的是"這報導"! 推 203.203.34.127 02/13
→ Seles:喔,六會了XD sorry ^^a 這要問Nico~~ 推 61.64.84.86 02/13
→ ouch:我當然知道後面的話一定是用來挑撥的... 推 203.203.34.127 02/13
→ ouch:也有可能是網友故意上來假造的,不是嗎? 推 203.203.34.127 02/13
→ Seles:別生氣啊`~~我的回答不是針對你啦:)別六會 推 61.64.84.86 02/13
→ ouch:如果沒有經過客觀的新聞稿,誰都可以放話啊 推 203.203.34.127 02/13
→ ouch:我想說的是:那一頁留言版就能代表事實嗎? 推 203.203.34.127 02/13
→ esnique:關於這是不是真的,後面有相關討論啊,可以 推 61.230.115.29 02/13
→ esnique:自己去看看,自己判斷囉。 推 61.230.115.29 02/13
→ ouch:我是比較傾向由較正式的管道去驗證... 推 203.203.34.127 02/13
→ ouch:因為人言可畏,加油添醋的人永遠不會少掉 推 203.203.34.127 02/13
→ MARSAFIN:借轉ALL-RUSSIANS版。 謠言止於智者:) 推218.175.239.144 02/13
→ zerkchu:menstennisforums.com一向都愛加油添醋:p 推 203.219.101.22 02/14
關於這是不是經過證實的
Dude
我哪知道啊XD
雖然我相信是真
不然我就不會po了
我貼的這連結你大概沒真的看八頁
因為有別的俄羅斯網友說電視上播出了
阿根廷的路透新聞
也已經有阿根廷隊的回應了
(到雅虎阿根廷http://ar.yahoo.com/搜尋Voltchkov,選NOTICIAS)
(但據信星期一時會有更正式的回應)
當然MTF是會加油添醋
可是這是目前唯一的英文版嘛~
所以真有興趣
就用翻譯網站一篇一篇去查俄羅斯跟阿根廷的新聞吧
但是我不太曉得你對「證實」的定義是什麼
那是對記者的發言
我不確定那跟發新聞稿的意義有沒有太大的差別
還是要有英文新聞才算
那……目前為止沒經過證實。
--
※ 發信站: 批踢踢實業坊(ptt.cc)
◆ From: 61.70.206.23
※ 編輯: Escude 來自: 61.70.206.23 (02/14 09:16)
→ ouch:看到Dude,我都很想唱KulaShaker<hey,dude> 推 203.203.34.127 02/14
→ ouch:如果Vladimir真的在電視講那些話,就不對.. 推 203.203.34.127 02/14
→ Gumy:借轉:) 推 61.64.84.86 02/14
→ zerkchu:看完全部的討論,沒看到Voltchkov有再度出ꠠ 推 203.219.101.22 02/14
→ zerkchu:來說話的樣子,希望他能出來對於現在情況似 推 203.219.101.22 02/14
→ zerkchu:乎越來越鬧大的情況下做個說明... 推 203.219.101.22 02/14
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------- <
作者: Gumy (新婚的阿根廷紅土王子XD) 看板: Tennis
標題: Re: [DC]Voltchkov認為阿根廷隊員都用禁藥。
時間: Sat Feb 14 09:47:58 2004
※ 引述《Escude (silence is gold rose XD)》之銘言:
: 關於這是不是經過證實的
: Dude
: 我哪知道啊XD
: 雖然我相信是真
: 不然我就不會po了
嗯嗯嗯XD
: 我貼的這連結你大概沒真的看八頁
: 因為有別的俄羅斯網友說電視上播出了
: 阿根廷的路透新聞
: 也已經有阿根廷隊的回應了
: (到雅虎阿根廷http://ar.yahoo.com/搜尋Voltchkov,選NOTICIAS)
: (但據信星期一時會有更正式的回應)
http://ar.news.yahoo.com/040211/10/amb5.html
翻譯網頁:http://babelfish.altavista.com/babelfish/tr (蠻好用的,推薦XD)
Wednesday 11 of February, 6:45 p.m.
Argentine captain presumed conversation accusation of Voltchkov
Buenos Aires (Reuters) - the captain of the Argentine equipment of Glass Davis
criticized Wednesday to belaruso Vladimir Voltchkov by declarations published
by the Argentine press and in which the tennis player was mentioned saying that
the players of that country take "nandrolona in the blood."
"He is out of position one," said to Gustavo Luza to a local transmitter of
radio a day after arriving at Argentina from Morocco, where the weekend its
equipment overcame 5-0 to the quartet host and classified to face Belarus in
the quarterfinals of the World-wide Group of the Glass Davis.
"they really surprise those declarations to me, specially if they come from a
shut up person, who almost does not speak, like Voltchkov," belaruso added the
captain of the Argentine equipment in reference to the player.
Voltchkov, creator of the surprise victory of its country before the Russia
favorite by 3-2 in Minsk, was mentioned Wednesday by the sport newspaper
Argentine Ole in declarations in which reference to the dopaje becomes.
"When they say that, of the 120 better players of establishment 47 they take
nandrolona in its blood, I I believe that all the Argentine equipment is in
that list. They already catched to Coria, Puerta and Chela, "mentioned Ole to
Voltchkov when reproducing supposed declarations from belaruso to a site of
Internet.
Between the players whom they gave positive results in controls antidopaje of
the circuit of the ATP in the last seasons are the Argentineans Guillermo Coria
, Juan Ignacio Chela and Mariano Door.
Argentina, semifinalist both last years and that is deluded with reaching the
end with an equipment led by Coria, quarter in ranking of the ATP, and David
Nalbandian, eighth, will face Belarus in Minsk from the 9 to the 11 of April.
CASE CORIA
According to Luza, nandrolona, a substance produced by the own organism said,
caused many cases of dopaje between the players as a result of its medicine
presence provided by the own Association of Professional Tennis players (ATP),
that "for that reason had to make blotch and counts new."
"There are several vitaminic complexes used by many players and provided by the
ATP, that always is within reach of the players in all the matches, like
rehidratacion salts, that were verified that they were contaminated with
nandrolona," it added Luza.
"only that it had a case was Coria and it was verified that the vitaminic
complex that consumed it was contaminated," it emphasized Luza, that it will
transitorily replace to Alberto Mancini like trainer of Coria while the match
ATP lasts that begins the next week in Buenos Aires.
According to Luza, Voltchkov "is number one of the picaros."
"This boy, who is in number 140 of the world, Friday against Russia retired
with esguince of ankle," remembered the Argentine captain. "Saturday, in the
opening ceremony, was with muletas and Sunday played."
"Just now it speaks, when we must face us by the Glass Davis. It seems to me
that it was disorientated, "finalized.
: 當然MTF是會加油添醋
: 可是這是目前唯一的英文版嘛~
: 所以真有興趣
: 就用翻譯網站一篇一篇去查俄羅斯跟阿根廷的新聞吧
: 但是我不太曉得你對「證實」的定義是什麼
: 那是對記者的發言
: 我不確定那跟發新聞稿的意義有沒有太大的差別
: 還是要有英文新聞才算
: 那……目前為止沒經過證實。
嗯,英文新聞也是有限制的,畢竟南美跟俄羅斯向來不是他們關注的焦點,西班牙文看來
是了解世界的必要語言之一(嘆~不會XD)
--
英文、中文、西班牙文,據說是世界各國通用語言最多的三個語文。
--
※ 發信站: 批踢踢實業坊(ptt.cc)
◆ From: 61.64.84.86
※ 編輯: Gumy 來自: 61.64.84.86 (02/14 09:48)
※ 編輯: Gumy 來自: 61.64.84.86 (02/14 10:20)
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------- <
作者: Gumy (新婚的阿根廷紅土王子XD) 看板: Tennis
標題: Re: [DC]Voltchkov認為阿根廷隊員都用禁藥。
時間: Sat Feb 14 10:51:25 2004
個人看法:
Coria的服用禁藥事件,後來被證明是維他命瓶子遭受污染(工廠的問題),也因此他的
禁賽令才得以被解除。(來龍去脈請參精華區),但是他的名譽受損,早就巳經不是 那
遲來的正義所彌補得了了。看過多少報導,還是說他"曾經因為禁藥被禁賽"-.-||||||
(畢竟不是所有的記者都會追蹤後續消息吧XD)
現在Rusedski的禁藥疑雲,也正在待官方確定中,前一陣子他才出席過公聽會。他的問題
出在於,他被驗出禁藥成分的藥物,到底是ATP訓練員給的,還是他自己弄來的?(這部分
跟ATP的說法有出入,請參前面新聞),詳情若有興趣深入者,BBC有很多報導。
McEnroe後來也說,他後來才發現,當他還是選手時居然曾經誤服了含有禁藥成分的藥品
,這是當時他本人都完全不知道的。在後來的專訪中,他也一再表示,使用禁藥在網 壇
絕對還是少數,根本沒有所謂氾濫的問題,Agassi等許多重量級的網壇人士也是這麼 認
為的。
現在問題反而好像比較出在於,到底選手服用哪些藥物,是合格的,確定不會有禁藥成分
?Roddick也說啦,也許,就是整年下來,只有都喝"水",才能保證不會出事-.-||||||||
(Coria後來也是這麼說的,誰知吃維他命居然也會出事??他才19歲就遇到這種倒楣事)
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
回到阿根廷選手都服用禁藥的這個傳聞,大柢就是從Coria那時來的,2001蒙地卡羅名人賽
他打入四強,賽後被驗了出來。當時包括他等一票阿根廷選手都被列入調查黑名單,Coria
罪證確鑿被判了禁賽九年的極刑(=終身禁賽),Chela好像是被處三個月,Chela詳情我不太
清楚...etc
但是後來Coria證實了確實是被冤枉的。
再回到白俄羅斯Voltchkov的發言,就是指上述的阿根廷禁藥事件= =.................
但是問題這早就巳經得到澄清。
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
好吧,其實我也曾經是當中的白目一人XD 受到相關報導的誤導,認為阿根廷選手都有服用
禁藥的嫌疑XD 初看到這則新聞,其實我也沒有很驚訝,只知道若看下去會被惹毛吧, 乾
脆別理他嘛XD
其實網球的確巳算是體壇中,禁藥使用較偏低的一個運動。一來成效有限,網球又不是光
靠體能就能達到Top的一種運動,但是在現今可能是比以前要可能使用,比賽太過密集 ,
加上球風的問題。ATP的防堵用意是好,但是別造成了選手間人心惶惶就好,雖說清者自清
,但是遭到"冤獄"的案件也是有的XD 即使後來澄清了,名譽的受損卻不是能補償得了的,
還有無數的後遺症-流言。希望ATP的防堵制度能作得更加完善。
DC難免各國會互相叫陣喊話(像法國Forget02年也喊過期待Sampras過來羅蘭蓋洛打DC啊XD)
,營造氣氛XD但是Voltchkov的這種喊話…未免…=.=////
題外話,Rusedski事件,據說連反禁藥聯盟都back他,問題就出在於程序。還未確定前,
他是無罪的。不是驗出來了他就有罪,而是到底是怎麼來的才更是重點。但是Rusedski
一開始的大嘴也很不必要XD,也難怪有選手(Woodbridge)反彈,後來就乖乖地閉嘴等待了
事關選手甚至國家形象的榮譽及選手生命,不可不慎啊…
--
有錯請指正<(_ _)>
--
※ 發信站: 批踢踢實業坊(ptt.cc)
◆ From: 61.64.84.86
※ 編輯: Gumy 來自: 61.64.84.86 (02/14 10:52)
※ 編輯: Gumy 來自: 61.64.84.86 (02/14 10:55)
→ ouch:嗯...推! 從很多不同角度切入看禁藥問題。 推 203.203.34.127 02/14
→ esnique:推 事關選手甚至國家形象的榮譽及選手生命 推 61.230.112.112 02/14