Re: [新聞] 台積電「企業文化太嚴苛」激怒美員工 外

[kyle5241 (Kyle Korver)]

※ 引述《qazxc1156892 (QQ)》之銘言：
: 新聞標題: 台積電「企業文化太嚴苛」激怒美員工　外媒曝衝突原因
: 記者高兆麟／綜合報導
: 根據美媒「財星雜誌」（Fortune）報導，在美國的人資網站Glassdoor上，有不少台積電
: 的現任和前任員工對工作內容進行討論，不過大部分都是對公司文化的抱怨，不少員工表
: 示台積電的強硬企業文化及輪班、服從等都讓他們感到不習慣，認為台積電並未為美國做
: 好準備。
: 「財星雜誌」（Fortune）Glassdoor上面留言表示，有工程師分享，他在辦公室睡了一個
: 月，且一天工作12小時是基本，週末要輪班也是常態，認為這裡的工作和生活難以平衡。
: 還有工程師表示，台積電的企業文化是服從，台積電並未為了美國做好準備。
: 根據報導，台積電美國廠共有91條留言，並有著27％的認同率，換句話說，大約只有1/3
: 的人會推薦別人去那裡工作。
: 更糟的是，台積電員工還表示，公司強硬文化會激怒美國員工和求職者，讓台積電在亞利
: 桑那州招募足夠員工的努力變得更難。
: 台積電亞利桑那州兩座晶圓廠將僱用4500名新員工，但台積電嚴苛的企業文化，卻與美國
: 半導體業顯得格格不入。
: 報導也引述台積電說法表示，目前台積電已為亞利桑那州工廠招聘近2000名員工，其中包
: 括600名工程師。
: 但在和招聘人員訪談後會發現，台積電嚴苛的企業文化、嚴格的標準和長達數月的海外培
: 訓要求，會讓現任和未來的美國員工對此卻步。
: 新聞來源: https://reurl.cc/M8bkxm


補充沒翻譯到的部分
https://finance.yahoo.com/news/chip-maker-tsmc-needs-hire-100000012.html

TSMC's rigid expectations for new recruits
對於新進員工有很高的期望

In Taiwan, TSMC is revered as “our guardian, savior, and light,” says Chou
Kuo-Hua, an accounting professor at Taiwan’s National Pingtung University
and semiconductor industry expert. The company, which earned $75.9 billion in
revenue last year, manufactures 90% of the world’s most advanced chips that
power high-tech devices. TSMC accounts for 5.7% of Taiwan’s GDP and is so
essential to the global economy that Taipei and its allies consider TSMC a “
silicon shield” that deters China from invading the self-governing island
that Beijing claims as its own.

At home, TSMC sets a high bar for its employees. Sixty percent of its
Taiwanese employees—and over 80% of its managers—hold a master’s degree or
higher, according to a 2020 company report. And the company expects employees
to know their place.

6成的員工還有8成的經理有碩士或是更高的學位

“Sure, TSMC might allow a reasonable expression of opinion [on work-related
matters]—but only from an engineer or deputy manager to the department
manager,” Joey, who has worked as a 5-nanometer chip engineer for TSMC in
Taiwan for nearly six years, told Fortune. “It’s impossible for managers to
express their opinions to upper-level management. This simply cannot be done,
” Joey said. (He asked to be identified only by his nickname due to fear of
reprisals.)

公司可以擁有適當的意見表達，但只有從工程師到部經。部經沒辦法再往上表達意見

Supervisors chastise workers who apply for overtime, Joey said. Most workers
accrue overtime to finish their heavy workloads, but many are too afraid to
ask to be paid for it. “It’s all a ruse,” Joey said. Fortune contacted
several new, U.S.-based recruits and Taiwan-based engineers, but they all
declined to talk, citing TSMC’s strict privacy policies and concerns about
retaliation.

(請自行翻譯)

“Our salary is only [for] 10 hours [a day], [but] we don’t leave until we’
re done. And we’ve never been willing to report it,” a member of a private
85,000-person Facebook group for current and former employees of TSMC in
Taiwan wrote in February.

(請自行翻譯)

TSMC’s worldwide turnover rate among staff that joined in the previous year
surged to 17.6% in 2021 from 11.6% in 2017, according to the company’s 2021
sustainability report.

(請自行翻譯)

Still, TSMC is a coveted employer in Taiwan, in large part because it offers
relatively high wages. New engineering grads with a master’s degree earn on
average $65,700 a year, while general full-time staff earn $32,800—compared
to Taiwan’s average annual income of $21,700.

Chou credits TSMC’s “highly disciplined” work culture that delineates a “
clear hierarchy between supervisors and subordinates” for its dominance.
From 2021 to 2022, the chipmaker’s sales skyrocketed, and its revenue surged
nearly 30%, reflecting the supercharged demand for chips during the pandemic.

But TSMC’s supremacy in pumping out high-tech chips isn’t making up for the
lopsided bargain it’s offering highly-educated candidates in the U.S.: a
rigid workplace with arduous training requirements in exchange for pay that’
s lower than rivals’.

TSMC 'doesn’t need all Ph.D.s'
不需要所有的博士生

Taiwan’s higher education system, where 31% of university students choose
STEM majors—compared to 17.5% in the U.S.—has spoiled TSMC. For jobs in its
fabs, the company prefers candidates with Ph.D.s and master’s degrees more
so than peers like Intel, says Dylan Patel, a semiconductor industry expert
and author of the newsletter SemiAnalysis. Earlier this year, job listings
for engineering roles reviewed by Fortune sought candidates with a Ph.D. or
master’s degree.

公司更喜歡收有博士和碩士學位的學生

Some industry observers argue that TSMC’s education expectations are
unnecessarily high, especially in the U.S., where decades of offshoring chip
manufacturing and the lure of Silicon Valley’s high-paying software jobs
have created a shortfall of hardware-focused STEM graduates. Consultancy
Accenture argues that the U.S. is facing an “acute talent shortage across
the entire value chain.” It estimates that the U.S. needs 70,000 to 90,000 “
highly-skilled personnel” to fulfill domestic demand for critical
semiconductor applications alone, in sectors like aerospace, defense, and
automotives.

有些人覺得對於學位的要求有點過高了

High-volume fabs demand some highly-skilled workers, like engineers who
research and develop technology to manufacture advanced chips. But the bulk
of fab employees work on the production line and don’t need more than a
bachelor’s degree, says Santosh Kurinec, a fellow and professor of
engineering at the Rochester Institute of Technology.

大部的工作不需要用到大學學歷以上的員工

“Ph.D.s are necessary in the industry, but it doesn’t need all Ph.D.s,”
she says.

當然需要博士生，但不需要全部的博士生

Another challenge is compensation. TSMC pays up to $160,000 annually “for
Ph.D.s with some good experience,” says an Arizona-based CEO of a
semiconductor recruitment firm hiring for TSMC. That same Ph.D. can earn some
$30,000 more at Intel, according to Payscale, a website that tracks company
salaries.

另外一個挑戰是薪水。公司只願意付16萬美元給有經驗的博士生，但是在intel
同樣經驗的博士生可以拿到19萬美元

TSMC’s American rivals, meanwhile, are defending against its recruiting
onslaught. The recruitment firm CEO says candidates have gotten “
counter-offers like we’ve never seen. Intel is... giving [people] $10,000 to
$20,000 to stick around. We’ve lost people that way.”

但美國的對手公司們卻也在防止公司的搶人屠殺。很多人都拿到很好的offer，
像intel就得要付更多錢(1~2萬美元)來留住他們的員工不被挖走

Anyone who’s talented and experienced is “highly sought after and making a
lot of money. The challenge has been finding folks at Intel [and]
GlobalFoundries to make a move without breaking the bank at the same time,”
the CEO says.

有天分和經驗的人被瘋狂追求，且賺了很多錢。但挑戰是如何挖走intel和格羅方德
的人才而且不會破產

Up to 18 months of overseas training

Adding to the recruiting challenge is TSMC’s demand that new U.S.-based
engineering and technician hires ship off to Taiwan for months of training
and cultural exposure.

Since April 2021, TSMC has sent 600 newly hired U.S. engineers to Taiwan. “
They are now returning to Arizona armed with…the most advanced semiconductor
technology knowledge,” a company spokesperson told Fortune.

The overseas training component, which requires U.S. staff to spend anywhere
from 12 to 18 months in Taiwan, is uncommon among its rivals in the U.S.,
even foreign-headquartered firms, says Justin Kinsey, president of SBT
Industries, a boutique semiconductor recruitment firm.

Hiring the first batch of engineers and technicians to train in Taiwan was a
“heck of a recruiting challenge,” says the Arizona-based CEO. “We’d send
30 jobs [to 30 qualified candidates] and get maybe one or two people to bite,
” he said. Recruiters say that some younger engineers viewed TSMC’s
overseas training as an all-expenses-paid trip to Taiwan to train on the world
’s most sophisticated chipmaking tools. But many candidates were unwilling
to go to Taiwan because of the strain it would impose on their families. Some
worried about catching COVID-19 and the territory’s geopolitical tensions
with China, while others simply didn’t have passports.

A corporate trainer who works with TSMC on its home turf says the company’s
new U.S. trainees are clashing with the company’s veteran staff once they
land in Taiwan, mostly because Americans don’t revere authority as much as
their Taiwanese colleagues expect them to. Still, she credits TSMC for trying
to “bridge the cultural gap.”

TSMC strives to nurture 'a well-balanced life'
公司開始尋求更平衡的生活

TSMC is making changes to better compete in the cutthroat battle for U.S.
chip talent.

為了爭搶美國的人才，公司開始做了改變

The company increased staff salaries worldwide by 20% in 2021 in hopes of
improving hiring and retention. (Recruiters say TSMC rivals have hiked their
salaries in return, boosting pay across the industry.)

TSMC says it encourages employees to “nurture… a well-balanced life,” with
its U.S. facilities offering fitness and health centers, a “variety of
activities and clubs, and a warm ambience,” a spokesperson said. The
chipmaker also “facilitate[s] several internal communication channels to
allow employees to share ideas and concerns regarding work conditions," the
spokesperson said. "We actively listen and provide change where needed.”

The company is also upgrading and expanding its Arizona training facilities
so fewer recruits are required to train overseas, but there will “still be
some roles which necessitate training onsite in Taiwan,” the spokesperson
said.

Still, to attract the large numbers of skilled workers it needs, TSMC needs
to focus on “develop[ing] a culture [where] people want to work… and stay,
” says a Midwest-based recruiter who soon will start hiring for TSMC. “Even
Intel, an American company with all the benefits, compensation, and years of
hiring expertise, will still have difficulties [hiring]. I can’t imagine how
much harder it’s going to be for TSMC.”

TSMC founder Morris Chang, the man credited with establishing Taiwan’s
semiconductor industry, has repeatedly said that the company’s success in
Taiwan would be difficult to replicate in another country. The U.S.’s “lack
of manufacturing talents”—as Chang put it—and its expensive production
costs make TSMC’s U.S. gambit particularly challenging. (Chip costs in
Arizona are 50% higher than in Taiwan, and Chang recently warned they could
double.) In Chou’s view, TSMC’s decision to expand U.S. production is “not
economically rational,” but the plan’s geopolitical value—to the U.S. and
to Taiwan, in the event of any conflict with China—may make it too important
to fail.

--
※ 發信站: 批踢踢實業坊(ptt.cc), 來自: 111.249.72.5 (臺灣)
※ 文章網址: https://www.ptt.cc/bbs/Tech_Job/M.1685959104.A.14D.html
推 oddoneislove: ”大部分工作不需要大學以上學歷”
推 nlriey      : 第一句超經典的怎沒翻出來，對台灣人來說，台積是台
→ nlriey      : 灣的救世主是電是光
推 NDark       : 他們搞錯了 就是要被教育荼毒到碩士才這麼乖好用
推 oyaji5566   : 太粗暴了
→ NDark       : 又要你聰明 又要你不可以自主思考 只有台灣才訓練出
推 steak5566   : 本來就沒有打算要請當地人呀 請幾個做做樣子 大部
→ steak5566   : 分就是運黃猴子過去啊
推 d86249      : 台積電在生產高科技晶片方面的優勢，並未對美國高
→ d86249      : 學歷應徵者提供補償：以較低的薪資換取嚴格的工作
→ d86249      : 環境和繁重的培訓要求，較低於競爭對手的薪資水平。
→ d86249      : 台積電的本土工作的企業培訓師表示
→ d86249      : 美國受訓員工一旦抵達台灣就會與公司的資深員工發
→ d86249      : 生衝突，主要原因是美國人對規則的服從程度不如
→ d86249      : 他們的台灣同事所期望的那樣。
→ d86249      : 盡管如此，她認可台積電試圖"彌合文化差異"的努力
→ d86249      : 後面那段有夠幹話，我們加薪了但是對手加更多
推 qwe78971    : 整段簡單講就是 低薪 要求高學歷 禁止思考 服從
→ qwe78971    : 不能領加班費 怕報復 沒有家庭生活
→ qwe78971    : 在台灣為何成功 因為其他人更低薪
推 nlriey      : 連加班不給報加班費還有臉書社團的發文都被放進來
→ nlriey      : 這記者功課做不少
→ bnn         : 台積的態度一直都是要走就走 總會剩下夠多腳麻仔
推 qwe78971    : 諷刺的是 台灣人當神來拜 去美國沒一項是贏的
→ qwe78971    : 它裡面有寫離職率 而且還逐年提高
→ qwe78971    : 福利 薪資 家庭 三項全輸 連加班費都不肯給
→ qwe78971    : 工作做到死 公司會找人報復都寫在裡面 有夠敢
→ bnn         : 他只要比當地薪資好上一截 就會有大學生留下
→ bnn         : 反正本來就搶不贏軟體 他搶的是適合願意留的工人
→ bnn         : 反正做久了他只要繼續贏過牙膏就收得到新人進去輪
噓 ptta        : 不爽快滾 後面排隊排很長
推 gametv      : Excel拉一拉哪需要讀到研究所
→ jim543000   : 早說了 台積只有在臺灣才能存活 也是受惠於人人有大
→ jim543000   : 學之賜
推 flower42    : 裡面好敢寫xD
→ jim543000   : 哪裡找高知識工時長免費加班又聽話不罷工的人才？
→ jim543000   :  臺灣啦
推 nlriey      : 太晚高學歷身材比例高，另外在台灣的高等教育中，31
→ nlriey      : % 的大學生選擇 STEM(理工) 專業，而相比之下美國的
→ nlriey      : 這比例為 17.5%，台灣這高比例已經寵壞了台積電。(
→ nlriey      : 一直有便宜又好用的新鮮肝)
→ nlriey      : *台灣高學歷人才比例
→ nlriey      : 記者超敢，這篇這麼辛辣，比GG黑還敢寫
推 ivanos      : 樓下intel奴工快來發表高見
推 Shepherd1987: 部經往上就不屬於塵世了, 看到聽到都是一層層rehea
→ Shepherd1987: rse過的演出, 自然會做出充滿自信的決定.
→ yoyoyolin   : 早說了，鬼島有鬼島玩法，把鬼島玩法拿去美國玩本
→ yoyoyolin   : 來就行不通。
推 steak5566   : 美國人靠北 HR就無法洗地了
推 denny0000002: 一群領著最低薪的人把公司做到全球第一，真是諷刺
→ denny0000002: 啊
推 tennyleaz   : 想看更多爆料
推 chter       : 簡言之，當台積股東，不要當員工，語畢
推 zaiter      : 就說美國派來造神讓台灣年輕人便智障的漢奸 滅國妖
→ zaiter      : 山一起來 其他行業全部便智障 人才都變奴才 品牌 汽
→ zaiter      : 車 旅遊 文化 藝術 藝人 電影 動漫 運動 全部都爛到
→ zaiter      : 百廢待舉 滅國妖山 把全台都變智障奴才
推 a524528     : 樓上在公沙小，沒有錢要怎麼發展文化
→ a524528     : 台積電本來就只是領比較多的台企，期待甚麼嗎?
推 zaiter      : 泰國越南柬埔寨之類的 文化都比台灣強 台灣就美國要
→ zaiter      : 培養來發展成奴隸殖民地 曹也說台灣實質根本就是美
→ zaiter      : 日的
推 EKman       : 這樣的推文真的是一堆妖魔鬼怪低端在亂講
→ wzmildf     : 你以為沒台積你就不會是奴才阿 蠢
→ wzmildf     : 你只會變成很窮的奴才而已，繼續看國光幫幫忙和康熙
推 w9103       : 他們只是把長久以來的事實講出來而已..
推 papamonkey  : 等等這不就是台積領先業界的秘密...都攤給你看了
→ papamonkey  : 美國人還不相信，還在用落後者自我的觀點來發表意見
推 geniusw     : 第一句是三小 哈哈哈
推 BigHurt     : 這篇好讚
推 johnlin35   : 推
→ apoenzyme0  : 說台積不需要碩士.因intel沒有
→ apoenzyme0  : 那實驗結果不就告訴你,其實是要的嬤
→ apoenzyme0  : 你想不透不代表它就不是事實
→ apoenzyme0  : 有些人也想不透GAA漏電流怎可能比FINFET差
→ apoenzyme0  : 但實際上就是有.台積的3NM也是一大群碩士搞出來的
推 winston11tw : 這記者很粗暴喔XD台灣沒記者這麼敢寫
→ luche       : 最後一段中文 台灣人才有這麼好爭取嗎？
推 AgentSkye56 : 降薪去台積就不是因為薪水 是為了社會地位跟權力
→ petesegex   : 台灣人的奴性可不是開玩笑的
推 WWIII       : 台積成功的關鍵就是找碩士做高中生的工作
推 Homedoni    : 世界第一的秘密都跟你說了 老美還看不懂？
推 vampirelin  : 在台灣能成功，是因為其他工作更血汗且薪水更低...
推 nwkasim     : 早就說過台積電的秘密就是台奴
推 a1379       : 台灣記者寫了保證GG公關馬上來關心了 嘻嘻
推 gametv      : 又不是每個人都在拚先進製程，有些缺只要Excel拉一
→ gametv      : 拉,PowerPoint貼一貼弄個排版，哪需要碩士
→ mangoldfish : 台積在台灣就單純錢給比較多，多數人哪有什麼wlb，
→ mangoldfish : 去美國單純就給的不夠高而已，不然奴隸哪有分國界
推 jamesho8743 : 有哦 奴隸有分國界的 美國奴隸跟非洲奴隸差很多 高
→ jamesho8743 : 等人的奴隸比一般人還屌 沒看大太監?
噓 sjerrysss   : 我在台積的同學明明一個比一個爽 大部分9點上班下
→ sjerrysss   : 午7點前就可以離開公司了 有加班也是加多少報多少
→ sjerrysss   :  這些文章弄臭台積電的意圖是什麼？
→ sjerrysss   : 不過我同學多數在IT部門 也許產線真的比較辛苦啦
→ k798976869  : IT也要看單位 反正愈靠近產線愈累還要常常on call是
→ k798976869  : 基本
推 sjerrysss   : 我IT的同學們可能運氣都不錯 個個錢多事少
→ sjerrysss   : 不過這些文章的作者只報辛苦的那些人 台積電很多過
→ sjerrysss   : 得很滋潤的單位都不報
→ wtl         : 爽的人哪敢大聲講自己爽 被上面老闆知道過太爽 事情
→ wtl         : 準備做不完
推 fxp87117    : 聘幾個白人演演戲啦，還不是要靠黃猴子
→ fxp87117    : 古有鐵路華工，今有晶片豬仔嘻嘻
→ ImHoluCan   : 半導體很多真的不需要大學以上的人，台灣ㄧ堆碩士
→ ImHoluCan   : 做高中就能做的事，真的搞笑
→ nxuanr      : 把民進黨送去大陸吧
→ ImHoluCan   : 每個公司本來就有爽的單位與不爽的單位，但台機電
→ ImHoluCan   : 就是不爽的單位大於爽的單位，爽的單位很少人離職
→ ImHoluCan   : ，不爽的真的很慘
→ k798976869  : 爽的單位就很吃學歷啊 非本科系 非電子碩基本無緣
→ peterkan    : 最可憐的是台灣員工吧，賣肝但薪資沒比美國人高.
→ peterkan    : 某樓不知在寫什麼幻想文，台積報加班，呵呵.
→ peterkan    : 大概只有直接人員會報加班吧.
→ k798976869  : 主管會暗示你不給報
→ k798976869  : 一線豬屎屋都可以報 但是也有硬上限40小時 超過就是
→ k798976869  : 做功德
推 hohoho2010  : 台灣人便宜，學歷高，奴性重，美國人比不上
→ peterkan    : 加班上限40幾個小時是勞基法規定的.給報就不錯了.
→ hohohoyayaya: 爽單位不只吃學歷吧 一堆女生連科系都不對 還不是從
→ hohohoyayaya: 產線內轉到爽單位 連不懂電子學都能跳layout了 什
→ hohohoyayaya: 麼進去再學 男的就叫你去吃屎吧不會還想來
→ k798976869  : 女的不算 因為公司想要盡量男女比例能達到1：1的外
→ k798976869  : 國進步價值